BFRO Believes Florida “Orangutan” is “Spider Monkey”
Posted by: Loren Coleman on November 20th, 2007
This is David Wright. I happen to be the “Know-It-All” to whom you referred in your article on Cryptomundo.com. concerning the Florida ape.
Please allow me to set you straight concerning this story and it’s culmination. First of all, I am a very active BFRO Investigator in N. E. Florida. Feel free to peruse my actual investigations on our site. We (BFRO) were made aware of this story early Wednesday, the 14th by somebody in the western U.S. who saw it on the Fox News website, and I was notified by another Investigator who knows this is my geographic area, and took up the investigation. Secondly, the speculation of this being a possible juvenile Bigfoot was already afoot in the area (no pun intended), so I was not the origin of this speculation as you smugly imply, “throwing around terms like juvenile Bigfoot.” In GOOD investigative form, I contacted the regional office of the Florida Fish and Wildlife Conservation Commission and was put in touch with FFWCC spokesperson, Karen Parker. Typically, it is GOOD form to identify one’s self when conversing with law enforcement officials as to why you are making an inquiry, and is generally a requirement for an investigative conversation to go forward. She gave the impression that she had heard of the BFRO, and enthusiastically put me in contact with the FFWCC officer that investigated the sighting, Ken Holmes. He was out of town on a case, but contacted me at my home that evening. He was very receptive of the animal being a possible juvenile “skunk ape” and even stated as you see in your own posting, “I can’t confirm that it wasn’t Bigfoot, that’s one possibility.” I also contacted the Baker County Animal Control office, only to find a recording stating that they were all at an animal control meeting or convention or something, and would not be available until 11/19/07, today.
In GOOD investigative form, I did not sit on my butt and take the story at face value like so many do, but got into the field to further my investigation by trying to find the actual witness, which I did on Saturday, the 17th, accompanied by another BFRO Investigator. And by the way, that was NOT the original reporting witness in the news video, as you wrongly stated in your article. I personally interviewed the original witness. It was in this face to face interview that I discovered that when the witness made his initial sighting, he saw a very distinct 2.5′ long tail on the creature as it “ran” through the trees. Upon retrieving his binoculars and viewing the animal’s face looking directly at him, he stated that it was the face of a monkey. Based on the size of the animal as described being 3′- 4′ tall, and running and leaping through the tree tops, that pretty much rules out the lethargic orangutan, and the long tail certainly rules out a possible juvenile “skunk ape”, leaving the most likely culprit to be a spider monkey. Monkeys on the loose in Florida are not uncommon, as being escaped exotic pets or more likely, wild descendants of monkeys imported to Florida for the early Tarzan movies.
So, you see, sir, it is precisely the good form of tenacious BFRO investigators going into the field to conduct face to face investigations and interviews to get to the bottom of a story with national attention, not sitting in the seat of the scornful, persecuting those who actually carry out such real investigations, that has proved to solve the likely identity of this previously unknown creature.
Feel free to publish this account on your website.
Regards,
David Wright
BFRO Investigator
About Loren Coleman
Loren Coleman is one of the world’s leading cryptozoologists, some say “the” leading living cryptozoologist. Certainly, he is acknowledged as the current living American researcher and writer who has most popularized cryptozoology in the late 20th and early 21st centuries.
Starting his fieldwork and investigations in 1960, after traveling and trekking extensively in pursuit of cryptozoological mysteries, Coleman began writing to share his experiences in 1969. An honorary member of Ivan T. Sanderson’s Society for the Investigation of the Unexplained in the 1970s, Coleman has been bestowed with similar honorary memberships of the North Idaho College Cryptozoology Club in 1983, and in subsequent years, that of the British Columbia Scientific Cryptozoology Club, CryptoSafari International, and other international organizations. He was also a Life Member and Benefactor of the International Society of Cryptozoology (now-defunct).
Loren Coleman’s daily blog, as a member of the Cryptomundo Team, served as an ongoing avenue of communication for the ever-growing body of cryptozoo news from 2005 through 2013. He returned as an infrequent contributor beginning Halloween week of 2015.
Coleman is the founder in 2003, and current director of the International Cryptozoology Museum in Portland, Maine.
So, you see, sir, it is precisely the good form of tenacious BFRO investigators going into the field to conduct face to face investigations and interviews to get to the bottom of a story with national attention, not
sitting in the seat of the scornful, persecuting those who actually carry out such real investigations, that has proved to solve the likely identity of this previously unknown creature.
Hmmm. I don’t think the BFRO has proven anything about the likely identity of the animal in question. Have they? I mean it is a pretty good explanation. I will give them that. But they haven’t really “proven” anything. Catch the spider monkey. Then you got some real proof. Then you can boast about how the BFRO investigations are proving things. Until then I really wouldn’t be using the word “prove” when it comes to things like this.
Maybe a Spider-monkey with mange???????
It makes sense. It’s a lot easier to mistake a known primate for an unknown primate than to mistake a squirrel for one. There were escaped monkeys and parrots living south of where I grew up in Vero Beach, thanks to the folding of an attraction called McKee Jungle Gardens, and I’d heard of other colonies around the state.
David Wright, a man of many gloves, play third for the NY Mets.
this is a very informative new article about the bfro & florida s orangutan. im sure we will see more updates about this in the upcomeing weeks. thanks bill green
I have since received an apology from Mr. Wright for the tone and language in his email, as he now realizes I was merely dealing with the “media report” of what he said.
I welcome his report from Florida.
Looks like a spider monkey, then?
I tend to agree with DARHOP. I’m not questioning the man’s truthfulness, but let’s wait until one is caught, shall we?
I do agree though it is not uncommon for those critters to be on the loose in the swamps.
Helpfule report, nevertheless.
Another example of BFRO arrogance. The old saying is true: “birds of feather go on BFRO circle-jerks together.”
Well stated, David. Keep up the solid efforts and sound research.
OK, if theres a possibility that it was an exotic pet let loose….wouldnt that mean it could be an Orang as much as a Spider Monkey?
Hm…. He’s pissed.
good investigative form and the BFRO are not two things i consider together or even being in the same state.
while there may be a decent investigator or few in the BFRO, they are by and large amateurs with no experience leading even less experienced noobs.
proper investigations begin with no assumptions and well thought out and planned interviews. all this ” the witness seems credible” crap is just an assumption that is taken for fact. if any thing seems anything then it really isnt is it.
i remember on BFRO report posted as a class B encounter. in it the couple begin with how deeply they believe in “bigfoot”. they go on with how many of their former “experiences” they now attribute to “bigfoot” after they learned things about “bigfoot” on the Internet.
they stated they went out to see if they could find “bigfoot” on their camping trip. it isnt too hard to see that this couple was so primed and desired to see a bigfoot so much they would have had an encounter in the camping isle at wal-mart. their experiences were some bird type calls possibles and whistles along with feelings of being watched. dont quote me as i am paraphrasing from memory.
ofcourse these folks encounter shouldnt be posted as a bigfoot encounter of any class. they were so over informed/misinformed that everything they see/hear/feel was bigfoot related. the investigator stated they seemed credible and were well educated on bigfoot.
this couples report is no different than one generated by the horrendously leading questions of a poorly trained/untrained interviewer. an example would be an interviewer asking or making statements like was the creatures hair reddish like so many people report or was it a different color. did the creature swing its arms. was the head domed. or like when the interviewer has a friendly discussion about bigfoot before asking the questions in an attempt to develop a rapport or gain the trust or make the subject comfortable.
both the couples sighting and one generated by poor interviewers are junk. they were both predetermined by experience and planting of information. as evidence they are useless and should never be reported or placed into any public database as a bigfoot encounter of any class or type because they arent. they are just story’s embellished by panted info and are not in any shape way or form evidence of any kind.
investigators all to often fail to verify even the most basic facts like time of day, weather, season etc. they interview with leading questions and doing so they plant information. this isnt something they set out to do it is just something those who are ignorant of basic techniques of interview and investigations do.
the BFRO picks their investigators based of ow many camping trips they go on and seem to frown upon independent and critical thinking. this isnt speculation its is simple observation and hearing from current and former members.
being the only scientific group or a scientific group [depending on who you talk to] would seem to indicate the need for proper training. it shouldnt matter the state of ones belief in the unknown rather their ability to investigate interview and present a final summation of the facts. these include the witnesses written or signed dictation of their testimony, the interviewers questions and follow up, the status of all facts that can be verified [after all if they lie about basic things whats the weight their testimony is to be given] . all of these things are importiant as they paint a picture of the report gathering process.
in the investigators report its importiant to include his questions to determine if they led the witness to any summation or they made the witness think that certain descriptive terms are more importiant to the interviewer. this is importiant because people want to be believed and they want to impress. if they feel certain things will make the interviewer believe or like them better they will use them, and probably do so unconsciously just out of instinct or human nature. this is one reason why eyewitness testimony can be so poor or unreliable.
simple training classes will provide investigators with these tools. even self initiated research can do so but roll play and instructor review is importiant to insure proper application of skills. this training isnt expensive and should be an over riding factor in selection as an investigator. untill it is the deficit it creates is just one more thing in our field as a whole that lowers its standing.
dont get me wrong, there are excellent investigators/interviewers out there. some learned thru professional training others are self taught and honed their skills thru trial and error. sadly the vast majority are sorely lacking in these skills. this leads to poor investigation poor fact gathering and out right ineptness that leads to the discarding of info that otherwise would/should be importiant.
this is one area that greatly reduces the integrity of our field. people look at the product of these investigations and interviews and discard them because the evidence and testimony was collected improperly. the very disturbing fact is that this is so easily corrected if not for the arrogance and ignorance of us who do such things.
people need to quit thinking they are scientists, crime scene investigators, FBI interrogator’s, or CIA intelligence agents. they need to realise they are plumbers, teachers, bankers, students, truck drivers and ordinary people who have an interest in finding something unknown/unproven . then they will realise that they are really in need of importiant education before they can competently conduct interviews and investigations. when such education and experience is considered mandatory the fruit of all our work will be considered solid, untainted and properly collected by outsiders and not the aimless collection of story’s and folk tales.
if i can learn such things then i know anyone can and they can do so easily and quickly.
simple Internet searches of how to conduct an interview or investigation will start the new untrained but eager investigator in the proper direction. it will be time and energy well spent. it will help you properly collect and document information.
FORGIVE ME, MY KEYBOARD IS STUCK IN CAPS ON AGAIN SO DONT FEEL AS IF I’M YELLING AT ANYONE
I NEED TO ADD THAT WE LIVE IN A TIME WHERE INTEREST IN THESE CREATURES IS ON THE UPSWING.
TELEVISION SHOWS GET HIGH RATINGS AND ARE REPEATED OFTEN. WEB SITES GET MILLIONS OF HITS WHEN A BIGFOOT STORY OR NEW INF IS POSTED. IT ISN’T LIKE THE GOLDEN AGE OF THE PATTERSON FILM WHERE TELEVISION NEWS IS INTERVIEWING BIG GAME HUNTERS NIGHTLY FROM THE FIELD LEADING OFF THE NEWSCAST AS THEY ARE HOT ON THE TRAIL.
OUR GOLDEN AGE IS THAT OF CABLE AND THE INTERNET. PEOPLE CANT GET ENOUGH BIGFOOT. WE AS PSEUDO INVESTIGATORS NEED TO HAVE THE CREDENTIALS AND PRESENT OUR INFO AS UNBIASED AS POSSIBLE AND STAY AWAY FROM THE LUNATIC FRINGE.
IF YOUR SUBJECT IS COLLECTING ORB PICTURES WHILE OUT SQUATCHING YOU MIGHT WANT TO FIND A MORE GROUNDED SUBJECT. IT WONT BE HARD AS SIGHTINGS ARE ON THE UPSWING AS PEOPLE FEEL MORE COMFORTABLE IN DISCUSSING THEM.
THE BOTTOM LINE IS WE HAVE TO TAKE ADVANTAGE OF THIS RENEWED INTEREST. THE MORE MAINSTREAM THE SUBJECT THE MORE FOLKS WILL REPORT SIGHTINGS. WE HAVE TO DISAVOW THE LIKES OF BISCARDI AND BECKJORD AND SHEALEY AND ANYONE ELSE WHO HAS LIED OR CHARACTER IS IN QUESTION OR JUST PLANE BORDERING ON MENTAL INSTABILITY. ITS SAD CA– USE IF BISCARDI WASN’T INVOLVED IN THE MARX HOAX PICTURES AND HADN’T BEEN CAUGHT IN A LIE OR BEING MADE A FOOL OF HE MIGHT JUST BE ALMOST ACCEPTABLE. I SAY THIS CA– USE HE HAS SOME INROADS ON CERTAIN RESERVATIONS AND ACCESS TO A LARGE POOL OF POSSIBLE WITNESSES.
While I agree that sometimes the BFRO and usually M. Moneymaker jump to conclusions, I agree with chrisandclaudia that it comes down to the quality of the interviewer. More than a year ago I found something interesting in the woods behind my house and I left a message on the BFRO website. An investigator came out and was pretty sceptical and didn’t lead the conversation into misleading areas. That was only my experience with the BFRO and that was before I learned about the shady Moneymaker and the leaps the BFRO takes to get to its conclusions – can you say Jacob’s Bear?