Kryder Bigfoot Video: Update

Posted by: Loren Coleman on June 30th, 2011

The man responsible for the video has stepped forward to comment. Here it is, unedited:

My name is Robert W Kryder. I shot and did the best job I could producing the vid. I did not and don’t want to prove anything to anyone. I just don’t care what anyone believes about this vid. It is what it is and that is REAL. I shared this to offer something for others to enjoy and use to gain more understanding … I already have recognition, respect and I am known for my honesty and integrity. I have nothing to gain from showing this other than friends and cooperation in finding some truth.

Wow, interesting to find and read these comments. Disheartening at first, followed up by disappointment. Sad in a way. I guess I never should have posted this vid at all. I waited 10 years to do so and only did after so many people I know urged me to do so. Now I understand why other finds and evidence fails to see the light of day. Who wants to share something just to be slammed by people who weren’t there and NEVER even took the time to ask. How rude. Just sit in here and write behind my back so I can’t answer anything. Fun to suppose huh guys? We here I am now ask….

And raisinsofwrath : You are just an ass. I never wrote any of that you liar.

I really love how all those people who have NEVER had their own encounter with a BF like to say what they WILL or WONT do. Like you know a damn thing. You don’t!!!

EVERY ONE OF YOU IS ALL TALK AND WON’T GO LOOK FOR YOURSELF !!! Keep your mouth shut and fingers still if you are not willing to go see. I challenge anyone in here to put up or shut u ! You want me to prove something fine, its on your dime now lets go! No excuses, lets go! Lets GO!!!

I worked that canyon area for 8 years solid. I stayed in a tent alone there for 8 mo. without leaving once. I/we had many many encounters in the years following this first time and know without a doubt what was standing there in the pic. This is the only vid I ever got and the only daylight sighting I ever had. Collected scat several times. Saw it close dozens of times at night.

John Ed Frost yelled BF because that’s what he thought of. He said it because these people have ranched these 100’s of thousands of acres for generations and know. They aren’t sitting on a couch and many don’t have TV’s.

For myself, I clocked in over 100 mi a week on foot in the field for many years. Not my living room (which has been a tent for the most part). Even now I have had no running water, no indoor bathroom, no kitchen etc in my place. Until you live out there for months at a time you shouldn’t make comments about what animals do or don’t do, or even what ones are there.

Here’s some truth:

They will stand perfectly still. Even 10′ ft off a trail as you walk by in the dark! Many, many animals do the same thing.

It was a long way away but I thought it was right in front of us the way he yelled… It stood out like a sore thumb to john who has looked at those mesas for 20 years. I don’t think it thought we could see it. But like just about every other creature you run into out there knew I would see it if it moved. To be honest, I really don’t think it cared !! It is a huge, proud, tough MF period.

It approached very close at night over the 8 years at our research site and didn’t really seem to be scared of us that much. It only broke and ran one time when it was exposed near the road in the moonlight when we emerged from a trail going to the truck. It stood up from crouching and bolted very very fast down through some salt ceders.

There are NO people running around out there after dusk. NO ONE. They are hardcore ranchers you just don’t get it. They get up @ 4:am and go to bed @ 9:pm 7 days a week even on Christmas. And don’t run around putting out targets, siliuette, cardboard, monkey suits whatever. People here work for a living and kill things endangering their cattle on a daily basis. They don’t shoot cardboard!

You people also don’t get that not too many years ago, cameras weren’t what they are now. And that people in some places are lucky to have one at all. This vid cam used in 95′ was the first I ever had and was one of the very first small cassette cams. It was 12 optical zoom x 10 dig. Before this it was film plain and simple !! So sorry its shaky… Gee you would think if I was going to fake it I would have had a tripod and not been jogging and out of breath. Geeze.

In the real world if you have a cam at all while you hike your either really lucky or a damn tourist. Most of the time its packed in my case/pack and in those days that was the first I owned. In the real world I never carry a tripod when hiking as I am not a photographer. In the real world your lucky to get the cam turned on fast enough even if its in your hands let alone set up a tripod in time. Yet you asses think its too shaky. Ya reality sucks.

It’s funny and cad that people refuse to learn. There are those like myself who have been around these animals and no one will really make the effort to learn from them. Just because the vid isn’t the way you imagine it should be or the animal doesn’t act like you think it should…. You say its not real. I am sorry but you imagination has no basis on reality. And the reality shown here is not affected by your vision of how it should be. Real just is what it is. I dont like the damn vid either. But Im not going to trash it just because the animal didnt run for me or that I was too far away.

If anyone really wants answers please write and ask. We have scat now that was collected mid winter @ 10,000′ in the Sandia Mtn range outside Alb NM. I would love to get it analyzed. I would be happy to offer locations, scat or whatever to anyone who is serious.

If anyone would ACTUALLY like to go out and get good evidence or will listen to the facts about the animals for a change please let us/me know.

If you want references on my character that can be arranged without a problem. Even those that don’t like me will tell you If I say it I’ll do it, and If I tell you I saw something then I did and can probably show you!!!

Thank you for reading. Please have some respect for people putting themselves out there and taking a chance on ridicule. It hurts the heart. I know I don’t like it.

Robert W Kryder
CEO/Project Manager
Kryder Exploration LLC
Teamster Local 492 NM

Full production and enhancement in HD 1080i:KryderExploration

Once again, I, Loren Coleman, without malice, must view this with caution. The total lack of any movement in the object causes me to wonder if this is merely a rock outcropping. This is not to say, at all, that this is a Kryder creation, but merely a misidentification. It’s happened before, of course. A simple mistake.

Loren Coleman About Loren Coleman
Loren Coleman is one of the world’s leading cryptozoologists, some say “the” leading living cryptozoologist. Certainly, he is acknowledged as the current living American researcher and writer who has most popularized cryptozoology in the late 20th and early 21st centuries. Starting his fieldwork and investigations in 1960, after traveling and trekking extensively in pursuit of cryptozoological mysteries, Coleman began writing to share his experiences in 1969. An honorary member of Ivan T. Sanderson’s Society for the Investigation of the Unexplained in the 1970s, Coleman has been bestowed with similar honorary memberships of the North Idaho College Cryptozoology Club in 1983, and in subsequent years, that of the British Columbia Scientific Cryptozoology Club, CryptoSafari International, and other international organizations. He was also a Life Member and Benefactor of the International Society of Cryptozoology (now-defunct). Loren Coleman’s daily blog, as a member of the Cryptomundo Team, served as an ongoing avenue of communication for the ever-growing body of cryptozoo news from 2005 through 2013. He returned as an infrequent contributor beginning Halloween week of 2015. Coleman is the founder in 2003, and current director of the International Cryptozoology Museum in Portland, Maine.

40 Responses to “Kryder Bigfoot Video: Update”

  1. aaronlife responds:

    If it’s a rock outcropping it would still be there, right? Sounds like this guy is familiar with the terrain, has anyone asked him? We have to ask ourselves what would it look like if bigfoot was just standing there still not moving gazing at a valley, for whatever reason. Would it look this this? Why not?

  2. bigfoots responds:

    Thanks for sharing

  3. mungofoot responds:

    OK, I do not want to offend anyone here by offering an opinion on something they post, so let me make a couple of points before giving my opinion of this video.

    #1 I am not a professional tracker, scientist, outdoorsman or hunter, although I have spent a great deal of time out in the woods observing and trying to be one with nature.

    #2 if you give permission to post vids or evidence for examination on any public site, you can expect to have it talked about in some unpleasant ways by people whose opinions and qualifications you think very little of.

    #3 A lot of the things that make you so sure you saw a bigfoot, are exactly what makes us unsure. For instance, you had the opportunity and ability in terms of time and money to be able to stay out there in the bush for 8 years observing I am sure you saw many things that cumulatively give you a much bigger and broader understanding of that area than many of us have, but lacking that experience we must then base our opinions on what we can see and that is what you brought to us. Now my opinion at first glance is that it was probably a rock or possibly a tree, I think the enhancements you did are interesting but not conclusive. I am not swayed either way just yet. I hope you will bring us the results once the scat you brought back has been tested. I really hope you have found what you claim and are able to prove it.

    #4 Please remember that though the people here have strong opinions it doesn’t mean they don’t want you to be right. Most of us are hopeful you will make it happen and thanks for finally coming forward with the video.

  4. whiteriverfisherman responds:

    It looks like a rock to me.

  5. mandors responds:

    I agree with Loren. There just doesn’t look like there’s any movement.

    Kind of like the “figure” on Mars:

  6. mrdark responds:

    Beware anyone who says they don’t care what anyone thinks and then spends many words attacking people based on what they think.

    That said, same thing as every other similar video: where’s the rest? Why did they not approach? What happened after they stopped shooting? The usual questions, as always without satisfactory answers, no matter how much Kryder dislikes them or the people asking them.

  7. Robert W Kryder responds:

    Thank you for at least offering the opportunity to respond. And no, no one has ever asked where it was with the intention of looking to see if a rock is there. I really wish I could have taken a pic the day we returned but it was spur of the moment with the rancher’s son, Shane. He ran into us at the truck-stop and said he wanted to see the spot. It was against his daddy’s will and we went with him while they (his parents) were at church. I didn’t have a cam in the vehicle. The property is off limits and the rancher has lost 8 cows a year so no one is allowed out there as they look for vehicle tracks. But the son flipped and wanted to see.

    The mesa is still there if anyone would actually like to check.

    The scat we now have does need testing. It was collected along with and in the area of cleared snow collected pine nuts, a large tree stacking/shelter etc… mid winter @ 9,000′-10,000′ elv – on top of old snow, dusted from a morning light snow. It is almost completely Pine nut shells. No grass or insect fragments at all. Just pine nut shells crushed. The scat was over 9″ long x 1 3/4″ dia. I don’t have the money or resources I can put toward this testing but am willing to allow someone else to cover it and get it done.

    Yes I was in there on and off for 8 years and solid for 8 months. But I was not in there for Bigfoot. I run a research and recovery company and we were digging for 12 hrs a day. Have you ever run a rock bar, rock drill and moved rock by hand all day? All you want to do is eat and sleep. I had a crew to run and investors as usual on projects. It’s a job and I had to perform on a schedule. So the animal was something that went with it as a matter of fact. It wasn’t to us what it is to you all. It was a real thing that was there and no one ever felt the need to go drag in the public. It was our critter so to speak and we nicknamed it Harry. My crew were all skeptical at first but over time all and each had an encounter.

    We were after several tons of buried Spanish gold concealed in trapped tunnels/chambers at the time, so the grandeur of what we were working on was already over the top. That’s another reason I couldn’t draw attention to the location and still don’t want to unless someone is a serious researcher and wants to conduct serious data acquisition for a purpose. Not just avid curiosity.

    I’ll offer whatever answers I can. I know a lot about how they act and habits, diet etc…

    Robert W Kryder
    CEO/Project Manager
    Kryder Exploration LLC
    Teamster Local 492 NM

  8. Robert W Kryder responds:

    mrdark : Sir, I didn’t attack anyone. I don’t care what you think of the vid ! I do care when you try to insinuate my integrity is in question ! Big difference and you know it. I am in here writing and willing to defend my word. Yes things happened before and after the vid. There is a damn good reason we kept going that day. I wasn’t there to film big foot to please the masses didn’t expect to see it and didnt really believe it myself until we did the enhancement (as this was before I stayed out there and had all the other encounters). I was there doing recon that was planned for months in advance based on satellite data and being paid for by investors. You see, reality is not as convenient as some of you would like. I had a 1 hr window to make it 1 mi N and do a quick detector survey. It had to be done no matter what. In your imaginations perfect world this may be a problem but it has no bearing on the reality.

    Your say ;

    “Why did they not approach? What happened after they stopped shooting? The usual questions, as always without satisfactory answers, no matter how much Kryder dislikes them or the people asking them.”

    But hey Buddie, I don’t remember you asking me anything EVER. Your bashing me without asking….. No one ever asks!!!

    Well really, its none of your business why we were there, what happened before, after or why we took off. That has nothing to do with the validity of the clip. And i the first 5 years I couldn’t have answered anyway due to terms of non-disclosure contracted with the project. See, just doesn’t fit your imagination* of how it all SHOULD to you be does it?

    So I told you anyway so you cannot use that anymore. And yo are just the kind of person I challenge with lets go… The area is there and waiting. You want more its on your dime and I am there bud. Lets go!

    From now on you need to ask me a question before saying I won’t give you an answer.

    Seems petty stupid or at least dishonest to insinuate my answers weren’t good enough when you never asked and I never answered.

    Why are you acting like a jerk? Are you one of those disinformation cronies we have all heard about. Out to discredit any and all evidence? Just an honest question as I cannot figure out you motivation at being so rude.

    Now why don’t you explain to everyone here why you are not willing to put your $ where your mouth is and go take a look? Chicken?….. Lets go!!

    LOL Cheers.

    Robert W Kryder
    CEO/Project Manager
    Kryder Exploration LLC
    Teamster Local 492 NM

  9. semillama responds:

    I appreciate all the time that Mr. Kryder spent on his video enhancement, but what would have been more convincing would be to return to the same exact location and shoot photos/videos of the same location to see if the same figure is present. Without a photo/video showing the location without that figure in the same location, the rest of it just isn’t clear enough to make any decision on what’s really in the video.

  10. RWRidley responds:

    Interesting. I have to admit I never really paid much attention to this video because I didn’t know anything about the shooter. Now that I’ve read your comments, Mr. Kryder, I’m more impressed.

    So, just for my own clarification, are you saying the “figure” was not there when you returned?

  11. kittalia responds:

    You know, if it’s a rock, then it must be a fake. If he spent 8 yrs there, he would know if there was a rock there or not.

  12. Nny responds:


    Cool video! I think who ever did the enhancements was doing an honest, serious job. One can really see a face being pulled out of the image with the more work being done to it.

    Also, at 120x zoom…. yeah, it’s impossible to have a steady picture. Not everyone now with video cameras has a tripod (unless professional or aspiring professional) and back in 95 I’m sure even less people would be thinking of tripods.

    I also liked the texture tool used. Again, I think the enhancements were good.

    That being said…..

    Just because you can pull something that vaguely resembles a face from an ‘uniformly’ dark subject, doesn’t mean that a face was actually there. Mess around with colors and editing enough and I’m sure you could find a dong hidden in the hillside too.

    I personally don’t know what it is in the video.

    It’s very strange that whatever it is, it doesn’t appear to move at all. I think it could be a rock.

    But it’s also awesome that by enhancing the image, I can see what looks like a face.

    So… what? Sew buttons.

    And I don’t know where the negative comments are in regards to this video…. prolly on Youtube as there is a lot of ugly, ugly hate found in Youtube comments, but don’t let it bother you more than it has. You’ve done a really good job at presenting this footage. It’s really, really good. I like the music used too.

    I guess the only question I have is the same one already asked… when you went back to the location, was there anything there that looked like the same thing in the video or was it gone?

  13. Fred123 responds:

    Outbursts of outraged indignation prove nothing. If you don’t want your evidenced critiqued, refrain from putting in places where you know that it will be subjected to criticism.

  14. Robert W Kryder responds:

    No there was no object there, rock or otherwise. As I have written many times. If anything it would have had to been a ceder tree as there simply are no black rocks for perhaps 20 miles. That evening we jogged out it was too dark to see the hill. The spot it was standing there was nothing on later inspection. The land owners kid said at first in the vid it looked like an eagle. But after he stood where it stood and could barley see over the hill looking into the valley he kinda freaked. The ground is red clay hard pan and sandstone. You could see ground disturbance/scuffing but no impressions. The marks looked around 15-16″ long but without any real defined edge.

    Like I said in the years to follow we were around it a lot and saw quite a bit of sign over the years. Mainly tracks and moved trees and such. But we did collect scat back then a couple of times. And even EMU parts from a nearby EMU ranch with no teeth marks but where the ends were bitten off. We also saw tracks and paddle cactus often eaten during the snowy months and sometimes the bite pattern was visible. Looked like a big human teeth marks/ mouth shape.

    I think in the video full version you can see that hill it is standing on before we drop into the valley. If there is a big black rock there it should be visible. I will lok closer at this and I suggest others do as well for themselves. There was a good 20 min between the first clips from above and seeing the animal.

    Robert W Kryder
    CEO/Project Manager
    Kryder Exploration LLC
    Teamster Local 492 NM

  15. flame821 responds:

    1] Mr. Kryder, on the internet please take every comment with a grain of salt, there are so many voices that often the most brash and abrasive ones are the only ones who stand out.

    2] I tend to agree with Mandors regarding the figure on Mars and the face on Mars references. If the light/shadows are JUST right even a normal stone, mountain, tree, what have you can take on an amazing shape or pattern. Similar to the ancient tombs and Stonehenge where you have to view it on a certain day at a particular time of day. (usually rising or setting sun if man made). The only real way to prove that is not what this is would be to have Mr. Kryder or a trusted associate go back to the EXACT same spot when the weather and lighting conditions are as close as possible to the original film and see if the ‘figure’ is there or not. If its not then it lends itself more to it being a living animal.

    3] The shape of the head/neck do seem ‘wrong’. (granted I say this without any living specimen to go by, just a gut feeling) It seems on the close up and enhancements that this figure has a huge neck and no noticeable jaw line. Granted this was filmed with an old camera with only 12x digital (not optical) zoom and the more you zoom the more pixelated an object becomes.

    4] As for whether or not this is a hoax. I do not believe it is. I believe Mr. Kryder is sincere in his statements and beliefs. At worst it is a mis-identification caused by the excitement of his colleague at the sight of something over half a mile away that resembled a large human(oid) figure.

    Mr Kryder, I am unfamiliar with this territory (I’m an East Coaster) can you tell us what sort of wildlife is common or even uncommon in that area? I am assuming wolf/coyote and probably deer and bear but is there anything else on the larger size of the scale? Also, how heavily populated (animal wise) would you say this area is. The scat you found, you state it was almost entirely pine nuts, yet you also say the Rancher tends to lose 8 head of cattle per year. Do you think the cattle are being eaten by a creature/critter, or simply stolen by other humans? Or perhaps there are other explanations you could share with us regarding the missing cattle (ie. are their bodies ever found, any evidence of kills, etc)

  16. sasquatch responds:

    I think it’d be cool if Finding Bigfoot crew contacted Robert and they did a show on this video-of course they’d have Bobo up there posing, but they could also do there regular investigation…Anyone agree?

  17. Robert W Kryder responds:

    Fred123 … I fully understand the video would be and should be critiqued. Of course I expected that. What I don’t tolerate is when a person thinks this offers them the right to condemn my integrity with absolutely no investigation. If I seem stern it stems from not being the type to have patience for profane, false or distracting attacks on my honesty. Just nipping it in the bud. “Weakness of attitude is weakness of character”- Albert Einstein.

  18. Nny responds:


    What, are you simple? That’s a terrible idea.

    I kid I kid….

    Truthfully…. Sure, why not?

  19. Robert W Kryder responds:


    1. Yes I really need to do as you say. After 26,000 views and some very rude attacks I have become a little quick to jump. I must apologize to those I may have offended.

    2. I’ve made that offer since the vid was published. I lack the $ /resources but I am wiling to go / point to give local, rancher name etc… to serious persons. I can give long and lat and bearing no prob.

    3. ??? I have seen 2 different ones in my life in daylight. Both in this area about 12-15mi apart. They both looked the same except this one had more bulk.

    4 thanks for the benefit of the doubt. If I hadn’t seen it after that in the dark and by moonlight close up or been around it so many times at camp or seen all the tracks etc I wouldn’t be so sure what the vid shows either.

    “Mr Kryder, I am unfamiliar with this territory (I’m an East Coaster) can you tell us what sort of wildlife is common or even uncommon in that area? I am assuming wolf/coyote and probably deer and bear but is there anything else on the larger size of the scale? Also, how heavily populated (animal wise) would you say this area is. The scat you found, you state it was almost entirely pine nuts, yet you also say the Rancher tends to lose 8 head of cattle per year. Do you think the cattle are being eaten by a creature/critter, or simply stolen by other humans? Or perhaps there are other explanations you could share with us regarding the missing cattle (ie. are their bodies ever found, any evidence of kills, etc)”

    Sure. But our team archeologist Stephanie Waldo made an interesting point. The answers to almost all these questions are either written in the vid descriptions and or the complete story and description of the environment, flora, fauna and conditions in the scrolling text on the full vid.

    There is no bear at all. None has been seen in over 100years (from asking local people). They used to refer to one of these animals as “The Bard Monster” years ago. And another (that I have ran into and its mean) is the “Red Peaks Monster”. Many local stories but they are usually too embarrassed to tell. The kids of the ranchers got them to tell me during the 10 years I lived there. If Ruth Danial’s is still alive she can tell you the stories and even show local native glyphs of one of these critters. She owned an antique shop in Tucumcari NM on old 66 west end.

    There is Rabbit, Prairie dog, ground and tree squirrels, badger, porcupine, coyote, deer, antelope, emu, ostrich, cows, pigs, horses, goats, sheep. All kind of birds from grouse and burrowing owls to golden eagles and all kinds of water fowl. Fish, salamanders, turtles. Pine nuts, ceder berries, grasses and grains, cactus and cactus fruit, yucca fruit / roots, all types of farmed produce and many creeks, sm rivers and ponds….

    I would ask please read the scrolling data on the vid top and bottom border for those who haven’t thanks.

    Robert W Kryder
    CEO/Project Manager
    Kryder Exploration LLC
    Teamster Local 492 NM

  20. Robert W Kryder responds:

    flame821: “The scat you found, you state it was almost entirely pine nuts, yet you also say the Rancher tends to lose 8 head of cattle per year.”

    I am sorry. We did collect scat years ago where I filmed this animal in eastern NM in 1995(the map location is on you tube). But this is not the scat with pine nuts.

    The later pine nut scat was collected in 2010 in the Sandia Mtn Range 200mi from the 1995 location. We have tracked another animal here for 3 years on and off. I haven’t been able to make trips up there as often as I like , only about 2 a year. But each time we had results. The last was this Feb 2011 where we (myself and my field assistant, team anthropologist/archeologist Stephanie Waldo) discovered and photographed some great prints. I have a good grip on this ones range and some feeding areas. With the pine nut scat, we found cleared snow to pick nuts and a large tree stack/shelter with’n 100′. It should still be there if anyone would like to go up and confirm. I am stuck playing doctor to my old partner (girl dog fed through tube) 24-7. She can’t hit the trail yet but we can pull off base camp while Steph guides someone back in. So the scat and hair I have now are recent finds. The interesting point about these are they were collected during mid winter at over 9,000′ elv. There was snow frozen under the scat with a light dust or snow on top from that morning.

    Robert W Kryder
    CEO/Project Manager
    Kryder Exploration LLC
    Teamster Local 492 NM

  21. HulkSmashNow responds:

    Hmmm, bitter much?

  22. joedastudd responds:

    Honestly it looks like a static object.

    I take any enhanced photo with a pinch of salt as the result of the enhancement is always affected by the person doing the work.
    Its like touching up a painting or drawing, no matter how much like the original you try to keep it the outcome is going to have a little of you in it.

  23. Kopite responds:

    Ok here’s my opinion, for what it’s worth.

    This is the first time I’m seeing this footage and I didn’t catch the original thread from late 2009. To me it looks interesting and it shows ’something’ that doesn’t look like it should be there. It doesn’t look like a rock to me, nor a tree. The fact that it doesn’t ‘appear’ to move doesn’t really mean too much as far as I’m concerned. With all that shaking going on and the subject being in view one second and out of view the next I can’t see how anyone can say it didn’t move at all. The camera is not on the subject the whole time and through a level/stabilised viewfinder. It may well have moved it’s head or a leg. We just can’t see.

    With regards to the Wooldridge ‘Yeti’ picture back in the 1980s which was later concluded to be a rock I would say there is a big difference there because Wooldridge was apparently viewing his subject for the best part of an hour and it didn’t move an inch. From what Mr Kryder says, it would appear that he was viewing his subject closely for mere minutes (I might be wrong on that) then he had to depart and move on. It’s perfectly feasible that such a creature could stand relatively motionless for a short while, maybe shifting a leg or so, which we can’t see due to the angle.

    All in all I give this footage a “hmmmmmm, interesting” reaction. It certainly doesn’t look like an obvious fraud/hoax. Too often these days too many people give everything a “bah humbug” kind of kicking and it gets annoying and I sympathise with those who out there actually finding things to show us and to get us talking. There are some places such as the notorious Bigfoot Forums where the grumps and cynics (pure armchair cynics I might add) are permanently encamped there for the sole reason of saying “bah humbug” over and over again and trying to give every little “hmmmmmmmm” a damn good kicking. They aren’t interested in doing anything else. It gets old. Real old. There ARE some very interesting “hmmmmmmmmms” in bigfootry after all. If there wasn’t then nobody would give the subject any time whatsoever.

    Just one final thing. I do agree with another poster that it would be great if there could be a recreation at some point to show the scale difference with a human in the same spot. I know Mr Kryder says he went back there so I’ll take his word for it that there was a huge difference but still, a piece of footage at some point would be nice.

  24. whiteriverfisherman responds:

    Geez! All I said was it looks like a rock. Lighten up.

  25. ETxArtist responds:

    Looking at this video is not going to provide any answers. Someone needs to contact a grad student studying ecology who would like to run a simple niche analysis. I’m sure there are a lot out there who would consider this an interesting project. I’d do it myself, but I just don’t have the time. Anyway, I bet that once it’s SCIENTIFICALLY analyzed, it will be evident that this habitat is not capable of providing resources for a population of twelve-foot tall mammals. It won’t even support a black bear population, right? Black bears are pretty big mammals, but they would require nowhere near the resources a giant primate would require.

  26. Robert W Kryder responds:

    korollocke :… (taking grain of salt)

    Hi Its a pleasure to read your input. Ok, Im not sure why you bring up other details but I like to share and love to have proof of my claims. People like you give me the motivation and reason to share my work and discoveries.

    First off, please don’t call me a liar, thats just wrong. Better do a search and see who I am before making that claim. When we took another look there was nothing there. Like I said these people don’t have time for pranks they don’t have a TV or any pictures on their walls for that matter. They live cattle and take it very serious. Shane is a great guy but his parents have shot at me and many others. Who would he have been trying to trick? There is nothing out there but cows… We have had to have the sheriff hold is mom so we can drive a county road access into the river bottoms without her taking pot shots at us. Like I said you still don’t get it and yes I will back it up whenever you like. Lets GO !!! Its not a static object. If you would actually take the time to watch the vid you will see it lifts its left arm. The frame by frame was done so you could see the left arm in different positions. Did you even look? Read the scrolling txt and this instructs you to this. I’d bet everything I own you never even did your own due diligence before writing the rant. Did ya? Its all good bud.

    “”Spanish gold…Really? Found an old young readers book at a yard sale did ya? I read it 30 some years back it had a rancher, mysteriously missing cattle, Spanish gold lost in some unfindable cavern and also a bigfoot just like in your wonderful tall tale, go freaking figure.””

    Well that was a little rude. I can’t say I ever read a book like that or even heard of one? Curious, of course I don’t read fiction. That is a real book right? I mean you didn’t just make that up to make me appear foolish did you? Since you remember it so well, I am sure you know the title and author right? I mean, if its real and all. LOL .

    I must say thank you for giving me this opportunity to give my background and some references. Your not just writing to a pimple face kid living under the stairs. What a joke. Please sir don’t insult my expertise or 28 years experience in high end trove recovery. – I own and operate an exploration company that specializes in the exploration-research-recovery-conservation of historical sites. I have been a recognized specialist in decoding cipher for over 20 years. I have recovered and been involved in Spanish Gold recovery many times. In fact if anyone would like to see there are around 2000 pics on our web site and we have another 18,000 or so yet to post (along with hundreds of hours of video):- – I and my team have worked with Fed, State and Local Gov, USFS, 100’s of private individuals etc… We are highly respected and have worked on state archeological digs including the famous LA-2. I and my team have assisted law enforcement in the location and recovery of bodies on the largest crime scene in US history the “West Mesa Crime Scene” Alb NM West Mesa using our 3-D geo-magnetic imaging equipment. Video of myself and team- stock footage channel 13 news Alb NM. My video enhancement has been used to prosecute truck drivers stealing fuel across the US. (Harpol Tucking Co. prosecution Tucumcari, Quay Co. NM for F.F.P. oil co. DBA “Drivers Travel Mart” in 1995) I am a Teamster local 492 and was picture car coordinator/ driver/ builder on many feature films (New York Times Move News ref “the Flock” with Richard Gear). I worked on movie sets for 4 years and If wanted fame I could have had it. If I wanted to fake a vid I would have done better.

    Thats great. Do you mean you were out there for many long years, or you went out there a few weekends a year for a few years? I have lived in a tent in the AZ desert 15 mi north of Phoenix for 2 years solid conducting research in 1988-1989 when I discovered “Coronado’s Winter Home”. I was a guide there for 4 years and some of my finds are now in the AZ mineral museum. When I say I have time in the field it means I didn’t go home! Thats why Ive encountered things like this. I really am sorry you haven’t. You seem a little jerked about it.

    Either way thanks again for the input and the open door to give my credentials/ background.

    Please search though before you insult people.

    Ok now maybe we can discus BF.

  27. Robert W Kryder responds:

    ETxArtist … I would love it if an unbiased scientist took a look. There is plenty of food. More than you can imagine. Did you read the fauna description? The most important part appears to be massive amounts of untracked land and water. Two things in abundance there. I guess you didn’t catch that these are ranchers. These are the same people who clubbed millions of rabbits to death each year for cows. These are the people who exterminated billions of buffalo for cows. They shot, poisoned or trapped every predator they could find! They even know who shot the last bear, when and where near 100yrs ago. There is huge open tracks of land like the Giegos land grant @ 100,000 unbroken acres with only one two track trail through it. Then there are farms and ranches as well…. There are FAR more resources in this area than in any pine forest on earth. Heck we eat all day ourselves while hiking by picking stuff on the trail year round if you know what to eat. People, settlers here didn’t starve like they did in the mountains. Year round water and food.

    We have our own scientists on our research team like anthropologist/archeologist Stephanie. Our Chemist/ Biologist/ masters in Medicinal Botany Iao. Environmental Scientist Steve (employed at Sandia Nat Lab) Eric researcher and computer tech – degree in religious studies. Bob degree in business with 20+ yrs HR exp. Jimmy, OSHA cert ex submariner nuc engineer etc… But I would assessment by independent study group or person on this as well other discoveries. If you know of someone please let them and us know.

    Thanks for the input! Cheers.

  28. Opalman responds:

    Mr. Kryder,
    Thank you for your interesting posts. I apologize for several individuals that seem to increasingly populate my area of interest. That’s not to say there no value to honest skepticism. I do, though, find the sarcastic attacks on your veracity particularly distasteful.

    The video is very interesting; I agree that because we cannot discern movement does not mean that the video subject didn’t move. And—I’m not really convinced I didn’t observe slight movement in the vids anyway. There are several famous eyewitness reports that indicate the exact same behavior (remaining very still or swaying almost imperceptibly), especially in very large (mature) individuals. Obviously, in my opinion, your videos are not of rocks, outcrops or trees. I would love for you to do some on-site size comparisons etc. My gut reaction is that this is the real deal. What kind of money will it take to go to the next step in the investigation?
    An ecological study by U/G’s, or anyone else for that matter, is pointless. Anyone familiar with the habitat there knows it’s a veritable pot-puree. Many Eco-Niche studies have proven to be totally bogus besides. (too much subjective interpretations) As far as the bear example; the Black bear has developed in a specifically montane / coniferous habitat not a mesa habitat. Unknown to many is the fact that the specific area of your sighting was generously populated by grizzly (inland brown) bear until they were killed off by bounty hunters (1800-1875) Certainly if the flora/ fauna supported that large omnivorous, apex predator it can support a few sasquatch—which by the way, undoubtedly, enjoy a very similar ecological niche’!

    Keep up the search, I think your very probably close to hitting paydirt. Disregard the crude and rude who would do well to imitate the sasquatches quite, noble nature.

  29. ETxArtist responds:

    Sounds like you have a team that could do some good work on the biology/ecology end of this. I’m assuming your scientists have at least BS degrees? I was a consultant for nine years, I know time is precious- maybe they know someone at their alma maters that might enjoy something fun and new to study for a semester? There’s a university in Las Vegas NM, and SMU has a campus in Taos, I wonder if they could be of help.

    Believe me, I’m familiar with ranching on arid land. I’ve spent a lot of time in west Texas, down around Big Bend. Cattle can really degrade an environment quickly- overgrazing not only removes resources from native species, it also causes severe intra- and interspecies competition. Did you know that Big Bend National Park was once grassland, before cattle and sheep overgrazed it and allowed the Chihuahuan Desert to encroach from the south?

    The animals listed would certainly compete for some resources, especially food, with a large primate, but for the most part there wouldn’t be a huge niche overlap between, say, a prairie dog and a Sasquatch. Scientists often compare Bigfoot populations with black bears because the competition for available resources would probably be high. Remember, that includes not only food and water, but also shelter, protection from predation, etc.

    I know you stay super busy with your business, but it would be fun if you could continue with this riddle in your spare time. Good luck!

  30. ETxArtist responds:

    One other quick thought. My family ranches; I guarantee if there was any spot on our property that a large mammal could live, we would know it. I wonder if any other local residents have heard stories or legends about the area? I know folks are scarce out there, but there’s always a cafe where ranchers have coffee and swap stories. If it was me that was investigating, that’s where I would start.

  31. mungofoot responds:

    @ Korollocke

    Give it a rest would ya? Jeez, we all get that YOU think it’s crap. We all get that YOU have no interest in this man’s story other than to attack and defame him, but maybe if you had some actual scientific data to prove your side, it would help your case but you don’t. Science thrives on data, you are offering only opinion. I care nothing for your response, just asking you to stop the attacks here. If you have an opinion, that is welcome too, all views can be shared but keep the nastiness out please, there has been too much of it here lately.

  32. Opalman responds:

    Mr. Kryder,
    It certainly is interesting how some people are so protective and identified with their own palaver that they fail to find and recognize the actual facts concerning the issues in discussion. Seems as though they’re in some kind of perverted competition where the prize goes to the poster who posts the most disparaging, insulting verbiage. Those same individuals would not last I hour amongst real scientists who at least practice civil and polite mannerism in disagreeing with an associate /pier. When I see disparaging remarks obviously written in the genre of personal attacks and name-calling I know immediately that the poster / writer is not interested in discussing the topic objectively—scientifically. Such conduct is used to fill the void left by the vacuum of ignorance.
    How on God’s green earth can someone who has not done the research know whether or not Spanish treasure might exist at a particular location. Has it not occurred to these folks that if that particular knowledge, of say for instance, hidden / lost gold existed the gold wouldn’t need to be discovered since it would already be discovered? Ditto for the lack of observation of creatures in a particular location. Isn’t this what the word research means?

    For those who might not be aware of the process, please consider this definition as found @ Wikipedia* (as well other sources)
    Research can be defined as the search for knowledge, or as any systematic investigation, with an open mind, to establish novel facts, solve new or existing problems, prove new ideas, or develop new theories, usually using a scientific method.*

    The definition does not specify name-calling (“dufus”) or the subterfuge of ignoring established historic / scientific fact, (subject area not being able to support large mammals) as a criterion for discussion. i.e. scientific method.

    What really bothers me is that obviously honorable, folks with the highest intentions such as yourself can be hurt by vicious personal attacks and thereby dissuaded from publishing their experiences in the field. That of course leads to a diminished number of reliable (or otherwise) reports to investigate, which culminates as less knowledge available.

    I realize that this post is a bit off topic and I wish more science related subject matter were discussed here—but this area of discussion and its negative impact on the cryptozoological field in general also need to be seriously addressed

  33. Robert W Kryder responds:

    Thank you and the others who strive for coherent discussion.

    I can see you are familiar with historical and preset environmental conditions of the area. Yes the primary apex predators was the Grizzly bear and Mountain lion. I was told there was Black bear but few in comparison to the many larger Brown, local known as “Cinnamon” (Grizzly).

    I would be willing to cooperate to do some follow up work (ie; size, location, los perspective etc) Or even field expeditions to acquire better evidence. I was actually thinking of moving back out there soon as I have a home there I haven’t been to in 6 years. With the current economic conditions here and the fact Los Alamos is burning just 30 mi north, moving 200 mi east is sounding like a good idea. If I make this move I will be out there and further study on this particular area would be simple enough. Although as to when this would take place is still up in the air. Conducting research from here is difficult for me at this time.

    As to how much it would cost would be largely determined by the objectives of the excursion and the personnel needed. A simple 3 day field trip to confirm existing data and conduct some short term data acquisition/ night recon-stake out etc… would probably run somewhere between (preliminary est) $1,300. – $1,700. I would figure 3 people min in the field. I own every piece of equipment needed. Thermal cam, night vision and many vid /still cams. To be serious I believe the only tough conditions would be the land owners themselves. They are hardcore. The son Shane is cooperative and may be able to trump the no access as he did for us last time. If not someone besides me would have to bring it to the table and make a deal with his folks (? pad their pockets ?). This is the part that should be done by an outside party ( as the objective the day I shot the vid was buried loot, that we did locate and had some issues with ownership after digging it with their son Shane… When we hit the target they (his parents) pulled weapons and said it was theirs and we should leave. Shane covered it back up himself and put a big rock on the spot with a tractor because he thought what his folks tried to do was just wrong). So I personally have not had access since. If I cannot get Shane on the bandwagon and willing to take a little family grief to get us in there then someone independent of my team will have to make initial contact and strike a deal for access with his folks. Then, I and my team and ? can come in as the field research crew. There are a couple landowners to deal with if we want to have good success but these are the toughest ones. Id rather not trespass.

    Robert W Kryder
    CEO/Project Manager
    Kryder Exploration LLC
    Teamster Local 492 NM

  34. Robert W Kryder responds:

    ETxArtist –

    I think comparing BF with an animal like a bear isn’t that wise. The normal distance traveled by a bear is tiny in comparison to an animal with a 6′ to 12′ stride. A 3′ obstacle/terrain change is challenging to a bear but its just another step to a BF. A BF (or any other true biped that large) could walk as fast as a bear could run. A closer comparison in range would be a large cat but still probably much larger. Bears do not have to have drinking water on a regular basis as they are not that mobile and conserve. From what we have seen BF has to have a water source. But a short jaunt for water could be 10 mi. (humans often travel several mi for water in many places). At least here, it appears they occupy the roughest most desolate areas with “structure” (cliffs, cracks, canyons, trees etc…) then travel to obtain/utilize rescources between 10-15mi. dist. I walk 4mph average in rough terrain on my GPS. A BF would be at least twice that fast. If you factor in that the ratio of obstacle size to animal size makes it all easy walking for BF then you can easily triple my speed. We are talking a waling speed of around 12mph. This seems consistent with the speeds reported in hundreds of encounters where they stated the movement seemed smooth and fluid walking yet traversed huge spaces quickly. I would think at a quick full step walk a large BF could cover about 30′ per sec. without breaking into a run. So, resource acquisition can be over truly massive areas. I believe we need to expand or view of the geographical area when we assess resources. Just like tracking – everyone tracks on the ground or from their own viewpoint down (under 6′)…. If you watch a person and track them you will see they leave almost no sign from the waist down on surrounding foliage. It will be from the waist up and most often around head height from moving limbs/branches from face contact. This is how you track a BF. If people would look up, between 8′ – 10′ off the ground they will start to see the signs of twisting limbs down out of face level, sometimes many years worth on a single tree or many along a trail. And places where hands have worn bark etc… Remember our faces are just over waist height to them. Do this. Take a 5′ pole, place it upon your head extended skyward… The top is where its head is! Gives a whole new perspective on the trail. Its actually kinda freaky to see and really imagine the size compared to us.

    As far as knowing whats on the land. Two points to make here. One is like the Richardson Ranch. They breed horses on 68,000 acres of land with 3 sons. They have had the ranch for 30 years and are still discovering hidden canyons springs etc… It all depends if it thousands of acres of grass land or rugged mnts. Te other point is when we conduct site surveys on private land we often encounter contempt as we find things they knew nothing about. It actually upsets some folks when you show them things like smelters, caves, roads, buildings they have never seen. Like “Mesa Del Gato”, when we came in from a one day survey, we showed the family who had ranched the property for 3 generations pictures of our days discoveries. On the first couple shots, one showing a cut road lined with 6′ long blocks, the father blurted out loudly… “Well that ain’t on our land!”… Then we showed more and more… He was blown away. And these are large immobile constructions that seem to evade discovery over 100 years of family occupation. Let alone an animal that is transient and move and hide. In fact, I have found it to be far opposite to what one would suspect. A very tiny percentage of landowners (large tract) have a clue to what exists on their land.

    Robert W Kryder
    CEO/Project Manager
    Kryder Exploration LLC
    Teamster Local 492 NM

  35. ETxArtist responds:

    -Bears travel much faster than you think, much faster than 12 mph.
    -Your trigonometry is off; go back and consider surface area of a circle a little more, in respect to the height.
    -Niche comparison between Bigfoot and cougar or wolves over bear is not valid. The scat you found didn’t have deer bones in it, right?
    -Landowners don’t know their own property? That’s extremely naive. I would suggest that if they don’t share intimate details of their land with you or act like they don’t know the layout, they are playing you for a fool or trying to throw you off the scent of something. Please.
    -You’re assuming Bigfoot cover large areas as part of their natural behavior. Why is that? I hope it’s not because someone like Matt Moneymaker says it’s true. That theory doesn’t jibe with behaviors I’m familiar with among primates other than our own species.

    Like I said, good luck.

  36. Robert W Kryder responds:


    -Bears may run fast for very short distances but read carefully, I was referring to walking speeds and stride. I have spent the majority of my life living outdoors and been around a lot of bears. Research the people killed by bear in NM and the woman that shows up in the Mora valley was 1/4 mi from our family (Essary side) property. My cousin Chuck Essary is a bear hunter and custom guide/outfitter who survived an attack in the Gila Nat Forest NM… not to run on and on but to offer that I know what I am talking about, I am not guessing here. Bears are not that fast and walk top 3-4 mph before breaking into a trot. They can trot along pretty good clip for a few hundred yards but thats about it. At a dead run with motivation a bear can out run a man for sure but only for very short distance. Not miles and miles. Thats why bear don’t chase down deer. In fact bears are actually quite limited as to where they can go and or how fast. The most common tactic to get away from an aggressive bear of any type is to run downhill if possible. They just can’t do it and have to take it slow. Been there and done that. Most bears cannot climb a tree let alone easily scale a 12′ cliff face in a hop as a BF can. Of course black bears can and will climb up after you if you try climbing a tree. As I said I was referring to traveling speeds in relation to range when I made the comparison to bear and cat. Not diet. I did not compare the scat of the animals??? What??? Nor am I stating or should it be taken from what I have written that the few scat samples we have seen would in any way represent a full description of the animals diet whatsoever. Either limiting it to or comparing with the diet of any other animal. I though I was pretty clear. So Back to traveling speeds and range. One more time. I was comparing the range of a mountain lion with that of a BF. The common range of a mountain lion is 70 – 80 sq mi. Up to 100 sq mi in more open country. Like I said, from what we have seen (not guessed) the range of the BF we have been around looks to be that of a big cat or larger. I would assume (guessing) that in areas that does not provide year round resources or desirable conditions at least some migration episodes would take place.-Bears travel much faster than you think, much faster than 12 mph.

    Yes landowners (as I said “of large tracts”) for the most part don’t “have a clue” as to what is on there place. Thats what my company does for the private sector. Finds things on their land that doesn’t exist. Also (Ill toss names so you can search if you like and not have to argue the point and waste time) My uncle Bob Essary was president of the New Mexico Cattle Growers association and my grand father Carl Essary broke and farmed 15,000 acres of farmland with 6 kids outside Floyd NM and Was the first to homestead and ranch the Mora valley and surrounding mnts. 12,000 acres of them. Again some re-searchable background to demonstrate I know what I am taking about. And no the hundreds of landowners that paid me to survey their property and my entire family are not in some conspiracy to “trick me”… Man come on. Why would a landowner pay me to find things he allready knows about ??? What??? Sure when its grassland, less than 10,000 acres and with roads you may know it well in a couple generations. But when its tens of thousands of acres of broken rough land and your out there to work, and horses won’t go there and you can’t see it from the pickup…. Its not there. Most large ranches are owned by those as an investment with ranch managers or lease it (I have 200 acres of the Cerrillos Hills leased right now and am here to find mines and mineral resources beyond the knowledge of the landowner) out to others. Really, didn’t mean to insult or anything but for the last 25 years Ive been paid to find things people don’t know about on their own place. I could hide 50 people in a group on many tracts of land and no one would ever know they were there.

    And really , you can choose to ignore my personal experience concerning BF, that’s up to you. But I will say this. Unless I make it clear I am guessing/ assuming then I am not. I am not assuming they cover large areas. I say it (as I said before) from experience in the field with a number of these animals over the last 25-28 years Ive been out there doing field work. So hey its not a theory (at least concerning the three in that particular area). Sorry but it (reality) just doesn’t “jive” with your assumptions.

    You bring up an interesting point. Not being consistent with primate behavior “besides humans”*. Of course our biologist would argue with you. Mentioning that even gorillas and chimps can cover great distances in “gangs” patrolling a territory perimeter. Baboons travel with migrating herds following food and water for hundreds of miles etc… The interesting part is that all the decent recent DNA has come back more human than some “people” walking among us. Homo Heidelbergensis possibly as a GUESS for a likely candidate on the BF family tree.

    And if you would like a scat discussion that would open some doors for interesting facts. Facts. The scat we recovered in 2010 Sandia range was found a few hours old in December at an elevation of over 9,000 ft in pine, gamble oak forest in the snow. Tracks were not evident as the temps were around 0 and the under-snow was frozen solid. The scat was covered by a light dust of snow from about 4am that morning. Ok, compare to bear… Ok better not as they are hibernating hardcore at that time. Cat do not eat pinion (pine) nuts. The shells were crushed and a wolf has no molars to bite down on the hard round slick shells or crush them to granular texture. So lets see, since the measure of the scat was over 9″ long and 1-3/4″ dia of 100% pine shell mass, mid winter, no grass, leave matter, insect fragments… The animal would have had to collect and consume about 5lbs of only* pine nuts shell and all. Meaning it would have to have the dexterity to pick out the small nuts from the needle/ oak leaf/ dirt forest floor after clearing away the snow. Then be able to eat them without shelling and most importantly, without getting anything else ingested during the consumption period. To say in simple terms. The animal had to have fingers, not use mouth-to-ground feeding and be able to eat and pass 5 lbs of pine nuts. As well it had to be able to pass stool in a type/shape consistent with humans only much larger. So, we are left with: Human shaped stool sample of 2-3x average size, containing materials requiring good finger dexterity for collection/ consumption, a large feeding volume, and a gut robust enough to tolerate processing/ passing the mass of sharp shell fragments, and found at high altitude in mid winter snow … One more thing to consider is that it was located about 150′ down slope from a vary large tree structure comprised of 4 30’+ trees about 18″ thick, leaned and propped against another 2 trees bent together. Some of the trees were broke or bent in place but 1 about 40′ tall and 20in thick pine, was there with no obvious source anywhere to be found. It had been snapped off and carried in. Smaller 10′-15′ pieces were stacked around one side (up hill – west side )loosely and stuffed and topped with some pine bows and sticks. When inside it was about 7′ clearance. It would easily fit the size animal we were tracking (maybe 10′ tall indicated by trail sign ) and is also consistent with the size of the animal required to assemble and entangle large trees and as well produce the size of the scat we recovered. An obvious conclusion considering the elimination of the other animal possibilities and the numerous corresponding evidence, would be the two are connected and from a massive primate.

    When all other standard possibilities are eliminated, whatever remains, regardless of opinion or likelihood , must be the fact. Considering every piece in this puzzle is consistent with primate behavior but no other animal, Primate is the natural conclusion. Since all available evidence demonstrate a massive powerful animal of great size. Then we must be looking at the evidence of a massive, powerful primate of great size in the Sandia Mtn Range New Mexico.

    Food for thought,

    Robert W Kryder
    CEO/Project Manager
    Kryder Exploration LLC
    Teamster Local 492 NM

  37. Robert W Kryder responds:

    A possible candidate for the evolutionary strand resulting in the apparent many types of what we refer to as Bigfoot. Larger, more robust and seemingly more intelligent by brain mass/body ratio and physical brain developmental standards. Although it has long been known they inhabited South Africa between 0.5 million and 300,000 years ago. Fossil specimens only 12,000 yrs old have recently been discovered in China.

    —“Homo heidelbergensis (“Heidelberg Man”, named after the University of Heidelberg) is an extinct species of the genus Homo which may be[1] the direct ancestor of both Homo neanderthalensis in Europe and Homo sapiens.[2] The best evidence found for these hominin date between 600,000 and 400,000 years ago. H. heidelbergensis stone tool technology was very close to that of the Acheulean tools used by Homo erectus.

    Both H. antecessor and H. heidelbergensis are likely to be descended from the morphologically very similar Homo ergaster from Africa. But because H. heidelbergensis had a larger brain-case — with a typical cranial volume of 1100–1400 cm³ overlapping the 1350 cm³ average of modern humans — and had more advanced tools and behavior, it has been given a separate species classification. The species was tall, 1.8 m (6 ft) on average, and more muscular than modern humans. According to Professor Lee R. Berger of the University of Witwatersrand, numerous fossil bones indicate some populations of Heidelbergensis were “giants” routinely over 2.13 m (7 ft) tall.

    In theory recent findings in Atapuerca (Spain) also suggest that H. heidelbergensis may have been the first species of the Homo genus to bury their dead, even offering gifts.
    Some experts[4] believe that H. heidelbergensis, like its descendant H. neanderthalensis, acquired a primitive form of language. No forms of art or sophisticated artifacts other than stone tools have been uncovered, although red ochre, a mineral that can be used to create a red pigment which is useful as a paint, has been found at Terra Amata excavations in the south of France.

    The morphology of the outer and middle ear suggests they had an auditory sensitivity similar to modern humans and very different from chimpanzees. They were probably able to differentiate between many different sounds.[5] Dental wear analysis suggests they were as likely to be right handed as modern people.[6]
    H. heidelbergensis was a close relative (most probably a migratory descendant) of Homo ergaster. H. ergaster is thought to be the first hominin to vocalize[7] and that as H. heidelbergensis developed more sophisticated culture proceeded from this point.
    Including evidence of hunting.

    Because of the radiation of H. heidelbergensis out of Africa and into Europe, the two populations were mostly isolated during the Wolstonian Stage and Ipswichian Stage, the last of the prolonged Quaternary glacial periods. Neanderthals diverged from H. heidelbergensis probably some 300,000 years ago in Europe, during the Wolstonian Stage; H. sapiens probably diverged between 200,000 and 100,000 years ago in Africa. Such fossils as the Atapuerca skull and the Kabwe skull bear witness to the two branches of the H. heidelbergensis tree.
    Homo neanderthalensis retained most of the features of H. heidelbergensis after its divergent evolution. Though shorter, Neanderthals were more robust, had large brow-ridges, a slightly protruding face and lack of prominent chin. They also had a larger brain than all other hominins. Homo sapiens, on the other hand, have the smallest brows of any known hominin, are tall and lanky, and have a flat face with a protruding chin. H. sapiens have a larger brain than H. heidelbergensis, and a smaller brain than H. neanderthalensis, on average. To date, H. sapiens is the only known hominin with a high forehead, flat face, and thin, flat brows.
    Some believe that H. heidelbergensis is a distinct species, and some that it is a cladistic ancestor to other Homo forms sometimes improperly linked to distinct species in terms of populational genetics.”

  38. Ragnar responds:

    So there’s scat, pine nuts, shelters, etc. over a long period of time. Show us. Don’t talk. Show.

  39. Robert W Kryder responds:

    Ragnar –

    ??? “Don’t talk”.???

    This is a forum with text only …

    I offered a link to our web site, see photos to see pictures, select, the one that says Bigfoot and you can look at: of some scat collected in 1997 (not pine nut scat that was collected in 2010 and is on vid.), tracks, still capture of enhancement by someone else etc.

    What do you expect? How am I supposed to not “talk” here and “show” when you can’t put a pic in the comment box. Nor would I put a dozen pics in this comment box. That’s why they have links:

    I would think if you wanted to see you would have read back and saw all the links before you write and ask for something you know I can’t provide here. Please do your own homework.

    Or, ok… get off your couch and lets go see. The trip on your dime if you want me to take the time to “show you”.

    P.S. You really want pictures of pine nuts?


    Food for thought,

    Robert W Kryder
    CEO/Project Manager
    Kryder Exploration LLC
    Teamster Local 492 NM

  40. cmrinc responds:

    Looks like a cut out to me

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