Bush Phantoms: Carter Farm Revisited
Posted by: Loren Coleman on November 21st, 2011
Jerry D. Coleman’s newly posted writeup, “THE CARTER FARM INVESTIGATION: Bigfoot, Bogeyman & Ghosts?” is stirring up a hornet’s nest on Facebook.
How do people feel about his findings at Cryptomundo?
Here is a segment of what he writes:
At this stage of an investigation one must pause and ask oneself a number of questions that have not been satisfactorily answered. Why has no solid proof of Bigfoot been found on the Carter farm, taking into consideration that this epic has lasted over 50 years and claims a dozen or so Bigfoot-frequented 58 acres of easily accessible land? Why would a researcher invest 3000 dollars to feed unseen creatures? Why would a researcher claim to use the Jane Goodall approach without having subjects to study? How could an untrained individual translate an unknown language with abstract ideas? How could there be not one clear photograph? And other than a witness or two, how could an entire county, including police and close neighbors, never, in fifty years, see a Bigfoot? How could a Bigfoot clan live, breed, eat and die in this open location without leaving scores of undeniable evidence?
Why would not a researcher willingly share any and all information to prove these Bigfoot? Why? The obvious answer is because there is no evidence for Carter farm Bigfoot!
But why would so few go to such lengths to defend a tale such as this? Was there ever a Bigfoot on the farm? Was the initial story and subsequent investigation on the level? Why was it that when Janice Carter Coy moved away from the area the sightings ended and the original investigation ended? Why ? Because by this time each of the parties had their own agenda’s to consider, promote and protect. This was not a joint conspiracy at all and it certainly was not a serious attempt to discover bigfoot. Why? Because the people involved are neither naive or gullible. What they are, are people, humans, with wants and wishes, which they have independently and purposely chosen.
To say more would only be hurtful to the innocent.Jerry D. Coleman
About Loren Coleman
Loren Coleman is one of the world’s leading cryptozoologists, some say “the” leading living cryptozoologist. Certainly, he is acknowledged as the current living American researcher and writer who has most popularized cryptozoology in the late 20th and early 21st centuries.
Starting his fieldwork and investigations in 1960, after traveling and trekking extensively in pursuit of cryptozoological mysteries, Coleman began writing to share his experiences in 1969. An honorary member of Ivan T. Sanderson’s Society for the Investigation of the Unexplained in the 1970s, Coleman has been bestowed with similar honorary memberships of the North Idaho College Cryptozoology Club in 1983, and in subsequent years, that of the British Columbia Scientific Cryptozoology Club, CryptoSafari International, and other international organizations. He was also a Life Member and Benefactor of the International Society of Cryptozoology (now-defunct).
Loren Coleman’s daily blog, as a member of the Cryptomundo Team, served as an ongoing avenue of communication for the ever-growing body of cryptozoo news from 2005 through 2013. He returned as an infrequent contributor beginning Halloween week of 2015.
Coleman is the founder in 2003, and current director of the International Cryptozoology Museum in Portland, Maine.
Loren, Steve made some bold statements against Jerry’s article. I hope he comes here to continue the discussion.
He claimed that Tom Biscardi’s crew verified that there was sasquatch activity on the Carter farm.
He has also posted several photos on his Facebook page, one of a beagle that was stripped of all flesh from the neck down which he claims was the work of a hungry sasquatch.
The photo is quite disturbing and curious.
Can you add the photo to these comments?
Let me quote one of Steve’s comments from the FB debate (it was a response to a query by Loren about having photos, footprints, and so on)
” why should I, I am not out to prove they exist, i know they exist,”.
That’s a religious statement…not a scientific one. He BELIEVES in them…Bo and Flo and Pip and Emma (or whatever their names are) and, for him (and apparently one whale of a lot of other people) that’s all that is necessary.
That’s fine. But Jerry’s remarks and observations are entirely fair as well. This story can NOT be proven, resting as it does only on statements by those who claim to have seen these creatures. And statements by people living in the area who claim the witnesses were honest (even though they themselves haven’t seen anything) but who might (I only say MIGHT) be motivated by the idea of possible TOURIST DOLLARS if they can keep this story going.
Loren, do you know what this reminds me of? The famous Skywalker Ranch. All the BEST stories…skinwalkers, giant wolves that you could shoot to doll rags and they just swan off like nothing has happened, etc rested on the word of ONE MAN, basically. Terry Sherman (called “Tom Gorman” in that famous…and useless book by Knapp and Kelleher). Even the samples of flesh shot from the “wolf” “skinwalker” had vanished by the time the scientific team showed up. The second half of the book is devoted to their sightings of a few lights in the sky…no interdimensional portal like Sherman claimed he could see every night at the same time and place (yet never managed to photograph) NOTHING. But Sherman, who was losing money as a ranch owner sold out at a big profit to Bigelow who “wants to believe” .
I think this is a similar case of “Much ado about nothing” and kudos to Jerry for a fine job!
Sharon, if it is Steve’s photo, I don’t have permission to place it here. He can come visit and add it, if he wishes. At Jerry’s FB page is now the url for this posting, and Steve knows that. He is welcome to comment and post, although I’m not sure how a dead dog carcass “proves” Bigfoot. As I said over there, “Where are the photos of all these Bigfoot that Steve, Janice, and others are seeing?”
Ok I joined here, how do i send pictures of my own, not janice’s, I have a non disclosure agreement with her, and will not use any thing of hers,
here is my statement on Mr Coleman story, I do not intend to beat a dead horse folks, but I lived with Janice Carter for 15 months, and do know a personal side to her, I signed a nondisclosure agreement with her and do not have permission to use any thing in it and will not, but while living in the State of Tennessee from 2007 till July 17th of 2008, she showed us the farm many times and took us to her grand fathers neighbors,and I pulled this neighbor to the side and ask him bluntly, have you seen fox and others, he he hawed around for a while, trying to see if I was trust worthy, or some thing else, what ever, any way he finally said YES, I knew her grand father and saw fox, that fox and company had killed live stock around the area, also I went back two or three other times, and talked to Janice, she said that Mr. Coleman did not investigate the old mayor or the chief of police at the time, now as to if I personalty saw fox, the answer is yes, I also Bo twice, screaming on a hill side, now people say did you get pictures, and the answer is no, and will not pursue because of the nonagreement disclosure, some will say I lie, but I am bound by law not to disclose, as for pictures, I have my own pictures, I have 26 sighting to date, three habituation cases and done research in 8 states and keep a low profile, I do not get along with Janice carter, because she says I have a big mouth, and may be I do, but the truth is the truth, tell me how to send my own pictures and i will do so,
As one who has met both Janice Carter and Mary Green, I do not wish to again get embroiled in the controversy. I’ll let others do that.
I do have issue with a few statements…
“Why would a researcher invest 3000 dollars to feed unseen creatures? Why would a researcher claim to use the Jane Goodall approach without having subjects to study?”
What is wrong with using a Jane Goodall approach? I see nothing wrong with someone starting with the hypothesis that Bigfoot DO exist, rather than starting with the null hypothesis. And if they do exist, what is a reasonable answer to all the many questions sceptics have asked over the years? Why this? Why that?
To me, perhaps the answer COULD be we are dealing with a level of intelligence that is superior than that of a mere animal. Perhaps we are dealing with a creature that is nocturnal, shy, desires not to be found or filmed or shot, and knows how to hide. If that is the case, what is wrong with trying the opposite of filming, shooting, or basically “outing” the creature?
Perhaps the gentle Jane Goodall approach could work where all the other “scientific” approaches have failed. It may not initially provide the scientific evidence necessary to convince the world of Bigfoot’s existence, but over time, it could. In fact, for the run-of-the-mill amateur investigator, I would say this is your BEST chance of proving for yourself of their existence. Get out there alone, without electronics and weapons, and leave food offerings and be non-confrontational. Let them come to you instead of you “tracking them down.” You’d be surprised at what happens if you are patient and have an open mind.
I know that is basically the approach I used when I was investigating. No, I don’t have proof. Not yet anyway. But I have experiences that indicate to my not-so scientific mind that perhaps I am making progress.
The poster who said, to someone’s statement about knowing bigfoot exists, “That’s a religious statement…not a scientific one”, I disagree. I have seen one. I KNOW they exist. I haven’t proven to you that they exist. But I have proven to myself that they exist, and it ain’t a religious statement. It’s a statement based on personal observations. Seeing is believing…..literally.
Did they look in the derelict schoolbus? Bigfoot may be using it as an RV.
“Seeing is believing…..literally.”
Oh, REALLY? So you believe the sun moves around the earth instead of the other way around? Because THAT is what you SEE. It isn’t the truth of what is being seen. You SEE the sun “rise in the East and set in the West” yet it does neither.
It is WE who are moving, revolving, flipping OVER (relevant to the Sun).
“Seeing is believing” you say. So, then, Criss Angel has magical powers, does he? If we go only by what we SEE he certainly SEEMS to, doesn’t he? Why, he can even WALK ON WATER! I’ve SEEN it!
It’s a trick…Criss can’t walk on water. I love the guy but he can’t do that. First he has to change the water into blood and THEN he can walk on it because blood is much thicker than water, you see. (Insert evil laugh here).
I could go on, Enthusiast but the LAST thing “seeing” is is believing. And I’ve mead that point.
DEVIL’S ADVOCATE WARNING!
SC Enthusiast asks: “Why would a researcher invest 3000 dollars to feed unseen creatures? Why would a researcher claim to use the Jane Goodall approach without having subjects to study?”
Let’s say the humans involved are poor, perhaps unemployed and could use $3,000 worth of groceries from a generous researcher…and the Jane Goodall approach would work on humans too. 😉
Cass of MPLS:
Yes, if we look at the general statement “See if believing”, we can definitely come up with examples where the eyes can fail.
I agree one could look at the sun and “see” it move around the earth. I agree one could look at Criss Angel and “see” him walk on water. Your point is well made.
Of course, how many of us would truly “believe” these events? I would speculate very few. Still, you could probably come up with additional examples less silly than the ones you used.
So you have proven that the general statement “seeing is believing” is not true.
However, applied to a particular event, you haven’t really proven anything. Much of what we “know” comes from our “seeing.”
I can’t speak about other people’s experience, but mine was in broad daylight and about 20 yards away. It was not for a matter of seconds but a matter of many minutes.
I think a better dispute to my case would be along the lines of mis-identification. That or the lack of evidence that proves my case, which of course I don’t have. Another good argument may be that I am just lying or looking for attention. That’s a good one. How can one defend against these arguments?
Well you can’t of course..
In my case, I believe I was close enough to make a proper identification. I would have been close enough to distiguish a squirrel from a chipmunk, or a dog from a fox. That is my view. There are very few creatures in the forest of the size I observed.
My point was simply it is not a religious belief. Religion has absolutely nothing to do with my conclusion. I don’t simply believe they exist. I believe they exist based upon visual confirmation.
Like I said, tell me how to post some of my pictures and see if you want to tear them down, first thing is seeing is believing, well lets look at that statement for a moment, as a researcher that researches the evidence and not to prove they exist, it’s some thing personal and perhaps private, you see if I try to prove they exist, then people will want to know where, why, when and ect, and that puts the forest beings in harm, I try to use a little common sense in what I do, the next statement, using the goodall approach, let’s look at her record, hhmmmm not bad at all, so lets go with it,
Carter Farm: Gee-whiz somebody got their feathers ruffled. Too many take such an unscientific approach. Right out of the box with, limits on divulging information, then quickly on to simply slandering people because their argument is unable to stand alone. Typical methods used to appear to gain ground. But in the end what we still have is no Bigfoot. Personally I would be so ashamed of myself if all that research time and effort to find a family of Bigfoot, on a few acres, brought forth no absolute, conclusive, proof.
Bottom line:
A “habituation scenario” yielding nothing that would interest a scientist is a waste of time to even discuss.
Someone tell Steve how to post his pictures! I’d see them.
You guys just don’t get it. You can look at numerous “habituation” sites that BFRO or other parties took over only to get no results. The sasquatch PEOPLE will entertain who they want. They’re not there for you to exploit them and they’ll read you like a book if you try. Don’t know that? Well then why haven’t you gotten your precious evidence in the woods much less someone’s property. If you had come to my property, they would have treated you like the plague most probably, unless you had like-minded approaches towards them. If you’re just out there to snap a pic, then good luck. Don’t buy my story then argue with my audio and the folks that know me. People that haven’t had them on their property or in a frequent encounter situation will never understand. It takes a long time to earn the trust and you have to be the right type of person.
All this seems quite suspect. For one if I had 6-9 feet tall bipedal ape men on property for 50 years i would have an entire library of superb quality photo and video evidence. And i’m almost positive that if you leave food outside, 9 times out of ten it gets eaten. and not necessarily by sasquatch. I’ve heard similar stories in the past. “Somtimes Bigfoot comes to my back door and asks for garlic and sugar” – Random old History or Discovery Channel Documentary. It just doesnt seem right. IF they do exist, then they obviously do whatever they can to avoid human contact and stay in remote areas. But who knows… maybe they like to play on school buses.
@ sasquatch: my sentiments exactly. Somebody – anybody(!) – please tell Steve how to post his damned pictures so we can get a look at ’em.
Look, we’ve already hashed-out “seeing is believing.” In response I say, “NOT seeing (the alleged pics) is UN-believable!” 😉
Thank you and good night.
The entire thing is suspect. I think it is either a hoax by a very clever person, clever enough to convince some folks (and if Biscardi is involved, it reeks hoax) or the delusions of a very mentally ill woman, who believes everything she says enough to convince hopeful researchers it’s real.